Tonner's City Girls...

[Evelien]

Where did you find the bad reviews about the hair and body? I'm having trouble finding them.

[magkelly]

There were several comments on someone's flickr account when they posted some pics and there was a blog post also. I just Googled Tonner City Girls and looked for pics and stuff and they just came up.

Hold on looking for the negative reviews again...

Here's one that's not too bad actually. It's much better than the others I saw so that's hopeful. I'm going to actually take a look before I send her back. If she looks okay I just might keep her after all. It does look like the QC is a bit iffy. This review talks about a few things but overall it's not too bad.

http://www.toyboxphilosopher.com/2012/1 ... -toys.html

One of the other reviews I read said something about the arms and legs and the body being a bit differently colored. You can kind of see that in the pics in the blog above. Part of her is more pink than the rest.

Update: There are actually no negative reviews left on Flickr where I think I saw them so I'm not sure of what happened there. It's like a whole discussion just vanished? I'm not real familiar with Flickr other than occasionally looking up dolls on there. In one of the CG pics sections there were about half a dozen people talking about loose joints, two toned bodies, very bad hair et all. All I can find now is one other review on You Tube, and that's not really a bad one and a mention of a loose knee joint elsewhere. I can't even find the original person's pics now. If she deleted her pic section would that mean the other people's comments get automatically deleted too? I'm thinking maybe so?

Well, any which way I'll know by tomorrow. I'll post a few comments here once I've actually seen the Astor they sent me, let you all know first hand what up. I can't open her box up to check and still send her back but I'll at least take a look at her and her clothes in the pack and see what I can see...

[Evelien]

Can't wait to see her! Perhaps not having your order cancelled like it was supposed to be, will turn out to be a good thing.

[Mary Kathryn]

$50 for a two-toned body and a mediocre faceup puts it squarely in the nope pile for me. Rufus Blue (80's version) from Integrity's head doesn't exactly match her body and after paying $40 for that I nearly flipped my shiz.
Please do share Astor. Hopefully your gal will be a better representation of the product.

[magkelly]

I hate to say this because it sounds snarky but I was not much impressed with the woman at Tonner's attitude on this doll. We tried to tell her there were issues that were being reported with these, hair and body color et all and her response was "Well after all you're only paying $35 and it is only a kid's doll." That may be true, but their upscale adult dolls start at the same price which is normally $50 not $35 and from what I've seen these dolls are basically Moxie Teenz type dolls sans the inset eyes.

MT's were like $20 and the outfits were like $10 so it's like they're selling MT type dolls at 5X the price and outfits at 2.5X the price when you think about it. For $50 I'd expect a decently made doll and decently made clothes not something that's basically just a MT sans the acrylic eyes. It looks to me like the clothes are strung on cards, like Barbie clothes which is not ever a good thing in terms of leaving holes and on top of that you have dolls that have issues with body color, hair style and loose joints and apparently they're not all that concerned because this doll is considered play line instead of an adult collector's doll. I just don't get that. I rather think at $50 and $25 a pop even a kid is entitled to a properly made doll!

That's a pretty pricey doll for most kids. $25 is about the max for most kid's dolls and it's not like most kids have that kind of cash to just be spending on a doll anyhow. So if they do save up for one of these it's a pretty big deal, I think. They're probably counting on these being a major fad thing like the American Girl dolls and parents buying them for them. But the MT's they didn't exactly set the world on fire at $20 and I think asking $50 for these and $25 for outfits is going to hurt sales particularly once the word gets out that there are issues. People aren't going to want to plunk down $50-60 a doll for dolls that have QC issues and while they may be kid's dolls it's the Tonner collector's that are likely going to make or break these dolls. I don't honestly see these dolls appealing to the kids so much as the adults. My nieces like my MT's but overall when it came down to it collecting them wasn't something that they felt was worth it at $20 plus. They've occasionally popped $20 of their own money for a MH doll that they've really wanted but when the price of a doll starts to get above that they start backing off and looking at other less expensive dolls.

I showed them and a GF of theirs some pics of these and asked them what they thought and none of them actually liked her all that much, and FYI they are right in the age bracket that Tonner is trying to attract. They usually like the Tonner character and fashion dolls so that's pretty telling. My older niece actually made a point of asking why people would pay $50 for one of these when they could get a better Tonner fashion one for that. She didn't think they were $50 dolls either. I asked her if this was something she'd see herself wanting and she gave me back a firm negative. In fact she wants a Nu Mood doll instead. More doll, same money, and that was pretty much my opinion too so far from the pics I've seen. I'd rather have a Nu Mood basic for $55 than this doll I think.

Who knows though. I mean I could open the box see she's fine and fall in love with her. I rather hope so because I really hate sending dolls back but I'm not about to keep her if she's not up to snuff. My aunt has said the decision is mine but I really think she'd rather not pay for something not worth it and she's willing to pop the same amount for a Nu Mood doll and I probably will do that instead. I was really hoping they'd be of better quality that this review shows though. Her chronic illness back story really appealed to me having spent a lot of time ill as a kid. I wanted to support that much for similar reasons to my supporting the Andy Mills doll. I wanted to show Tonner that his making dolls that have heart really does make a difference to me, but I just can't rationalize paying this much for a doll that's just not very well made if indeed she's got these issues. I'm trying very hard not to prejudge her but I'm not really managing well after seeing those pics I must admit. But I'll wait till she's here....

One thing I did notice though. What they showed in the preview pics and at Toy Fair and what is being shipped there are some differences. The cape outfit definitely had better boots. Astor's bag looked like vinyl in some pics and now it's cloth. I'm sure it's just an issue of material availability but when I see distinct differences from the press photos of a doll and the actual dolls they send it tends to make me leery of buying that doll. I'm used to hair looking better in promo pics. That's par for the course. They have stylists primping these dolls before the shoots, of course, but I don't like to see shoe changes, bags altered etc, not unless the initial pics are updated to reflect those changes. I hope they do go there because the demo shots make the dolls look a lot better than what I am seeing above...

[Evelien]

Wow, that IS a very unimpressive comment. You'd think Tonner would take their reputation and their customers' opinions more seriously.

[magkelly]

I sent them a copy of that blog post. This is the email I got back. I don't know quite what to think of it. Hopefully they actually sent it on and hopefully someone will show it to Robert and he and his staff will address this, but I'm really debating at this point if I want to quit collecting Tonner dolls. I used to just love his dolls but the last few collections they just have not moved me into buying much at all. I find myself going back to older second market dolls not just because they are less expensive but because I just can't find much in the current collections that I'd want to have. I did like the Nu Mood basic dolls, one of them anyhow, but other than that nothing really spoke to me. I ended up getting the Delilah's for Christmas instead and I think I am happy with that for now. UPS still hasn't been here as yet but I'll keep you all posted.

Hello!

Thanks so much for your email and interest in TONNER.

I will definitely forward this to the NY corporate offices and that of TonnerToys, we appreciate you sharing this with us...and yes, the TonnerToys is a toy company and 100% safety tested and designed for children, we will definitely let them know and read this too...

Important information for us to have and be able to address as well...thank you so much...we appreciate you taking the time to write and share your comments and thoughts.

Thanks again, have a wonderful day!

Michelle

[magkelly]

Personal thoughts on Astor....

Well, she's not as bad as she appeared to be in the review above so it looks like I got a bit better example of the doll than the Toy Box Philosopher and the woman on Flickr did. She's not without flaws however. The difference in skin tones from the bottom legs to the tops is not as significant as I've seen it in other pics of Astor but yeah, there is a more pink tone to the bottom legs, though interestingly her arms are fine unlike pics of the other Astors. Whether or not she'll stay like this or get more two toned as she ages is something I am rather wondering right now though. Her left ankle was slightly indented from a tie though which was wound too tight but probably could be sanded down smooth if I wanted to bother. Her legs are a bit soft it would seem and I will have to really watch them for damage if a box tie can do that.

No loose joints otherwise on the contrary she's quite tight, except, and again this is what I expected from the reviews I saw, her knees are very loose and as a result she will slouch and not stand straight sans a support. (Very MT like in that respect. I can't get them to stand or sit up straight half the time either! But she has the body I wish they all had I will admit.) She is very well articulated and sits well otherwise. The TBP review mentioned her head can't look up and down, that's quite true, it's side to side only. Weight-wise she falls between a Moxie Teen and a regular Tonner girl, though she's definitely more on the MT end than the Tyler end. She was a bit heavier than I expected and is fairly well made. Her seams are not very smooth though. You can see them on her legs which are nice, particularly the knees, which are indeed very 2nd generation Fashionista like.

Hair is a bit fly away, doesn't appear gel was used at all on mine, but the bangs look good. It's very soft, very nice and the color is just lovely. It's a perfect flaming copper red. Her hair is Cleo style and hits right above the shoulders. It's a bit shorter than in some of the other pics I've seen but is pretty well done. Don't think I'd cut it shorter than that though I might even it out a little and spray it to keep it under control a bit more. Face? Very well done, not as vacant as I was expecting from the reviews and her mouth is fairly well painted. She's just toothy enough that it's attractive. I was expecting her face to be a lot cruder actually from the pics I'd seen but mine appears okay. She's quite cute actually though I agree with one thing, the bit of white under the eyes, that needs to go. She looks like her liner is incomplete and that would bug me over time. Lips and nails are a coral pink and her blush is a lit less apparent than in the pics I've seen. It's not a bad face up at all and she looks great in the sparkly number which is actually more of a light sea foam mermaid color not a turquoise color. Eye color is somewhere between teal green and blue and the paint is variegated so that's nice.

Outfits? I was not all that impressed with the way her clothes were packaged. Those pesky plastic tabs were all over the place and I had to be VERY careful when it came to removing them or she would have likely had a couple of extremely ripped up outfits. As it was with care I was able to minimize holes but yeah, this is not good. I would really hesitate to buy another outfit for her given all those tabs. Shoes, good stretchy plastic and I did not notice the red ones putting any stain on her feet. Stretchy is very good in this case because with tights putting the silver shoes on her was not easy. The tights were a bit too loose on her legs. The glitter on the whole outfit is floating off just a bit, but it's very cute. Tonner loses some points for the velcro here though. A kid old enough to enjoy this level of doll is old enough to use snaps and the outfit is on the nice side for velcro.

Size-wise I'd say she's very close to Ty Girlz and MT clothes though being slightly taller the pants would likely be a little short. Skirts and tops should fit just fine.The shoes though are much bigger, longer than MT shoes which means likely she's not going to fit into anything that they can wear. Definitely bigger than MH and Stardoll shoes too, I think, though I may try that later and see. I'm going to have to go through my shoes and see what works but I have a feeling it's her own shoes and maybe the Jakks Elle stuff that will fit. Maybe those Harumika shoes because they are actually bit long on the MT's. But she's definitely got odd feet compared to a lot of other dolls I have and will be harder to match than some.

I was not particularly crazy about the outfit she came in. The top will work with jeans and I like the shoes but I'm not liking the cheap bag, skirt or the shrug on the green outfit. I didn't notice any bad stitching, so again I think I might have gotten a good example compared to some. Overall the quality is a bit better than the MT stuff but again I was sitting there fighting punch tabs and finding tiny holes so that kind of negates the slightly better clothes for me. I mean what's the sense of making decent clothes for these dolls if they will have holes in them when they arrive? I managed to keep that to a minimum but I had to work at it and the tights they were particularly tricky. It would have been very easy to ruin them.

On a scale of 1-10 I'd rate her and her outfits at about a 7. She's better than I expected from the reviews but she's not as good as she could be coming from Tonner. There are QC issues that need to be addressed. For a kid at $30 I think she would work okay. At $50-60 I do think she'd be overpriced. Am I keeping her? Yes, I think I am, though admittedly it's more because I really, really liked the sea foam outfit and wanted to have a suitable doll to display it than because I fell in love with Astor. I like her, but I don't LOVE her, at least not yet. She may grow on me though, I think with time and with the opportunity to make her more clothes, so yeah, I am keeping her.

Would I buy another one though? No. I don't think so which is a rare statement for me to make. I usually like to get 2-3 play dolls from a new playline, so they'll have pals. But I'm just not that into getting more of these from looking at this one. As a one off I think I'll have some fun with her, but I just can't see spending $50-60 a pop to get her some friends. Half that on clearance maybe with free shipping, laugh, but not full price, no way, no how. I still think she was a bit over priced at $35 though she is a bit nicer than I thought she would be.

Pics later. I'm still not feeling great at all today and I was up all day waiting for the UPS truck. They didn't show until almost 8 so I'm wiped out now. Too tired to play anymore. I'm going to put Astor up in a shelf and go to bed for a while...

Didn't work. I can't sleep. I'm too tired apparently and my head is so congested that it aches a bit. I'm having problems laying down and breathing so sleeping is eluding me for the moment. Darn I hate it when I'm like this. Anyway, I tried a lot of shoes, Elle shoes, MT shoes, Haru, Jem shoes, MH shoes, nothing in any of my shoe boxes fits her. The larger Tonner type doll shoes are too big. The rest are too small. Some look like they might except the arch on her feet is very extreme compared to most of the other dolls I have and I can't make them work because of that. About the only thing that worked besides her own shoes was this old pair of Butterfly ring doll shoe bases. They look to conform to her feet so maybe their shoes would work but I'm not too encouraged here. Looks like this girl is going to need custom shoes made or I'd have to buy more clothes to get her a black pair which I don't think I really want to do. I'm kind of glad I bought her the extra outfit now because short of making her some it looks like she's only going to have two pairs to work with...

[Evelien]

Thanks for typing that up! Even though you're not feeling well, your info is as detailed as ever ^^. I'd love to see pics.

I really really like Taxi Billy from the pics but I don't think I'll get her because of the price tag + expensive shipping to the Netherlands.

[Mary Kathryn]

Thanks for typing that up! Even though you're not feeling well, your info is as detailed as ever ^^. I'd love to see pics.

This. I hope you feel better soon!