A Newb's Question About Doll Hair Types

[WhiteDove01s]

Ok, I have a lot of back room Barbie heads I've been de-hairing, in preparation to reuse them for various chara dolls. I've also washed, braided, and detangled the hair so I could save any braids for reuse as needed... though I can't imagine needing quite that much platinum blond.

During all this, I've noticed some things about the hair I've saved as well as what I'm braiding and collecting now from some hair pieces purchased at the Dollar Tree. I know there are different kinds of doll hair, and this makes it pretty obvious... What I'd like to know is, is there an easy way to tell which is which?

To explain a bit more, some of the hair (mostly ash blond, but also auburn on a Midge) is fine, matte in color, and feels soft. Some is shinier (and usually a more gold-blond). The Dollar Tree stuff is very very shiny in all colors, unnaturally so if compared to most human hair outside of a shampoo commercial.

I also know some kinds of doll hair can be styled with boiling water, and some will damage. I don't want to find out what kind each is by damaging it, unless I have to boil test pieces to try to figure out what each kind is. So, can anyone give me a possible clue as to which is the 'shiny' hair and which is the more 'matte' hair so I can determine what kind of hair each braid is and sort it accordingly?

[maywong]

If you go to dollyhair.com it explaines the different hair types.

[WhiteDove01s]

Yes, I've been to Dollyhair.com and I'm still a little confused. Most of the descriptions talk about how the hair feels, not how shiny it is, and I'm having a little trouble being sure from the thumbnail images.

My best guess is like this:

The Dollar Tree hair could be nylon, but I might have to boil some and see if it damages it to know. It could also be saran. Again, the best guess I have for testing it would be to boil some, as saran is very hot water resistant and nylon is very not. Polypropylene looks and styles just like nylon, so it could be that wouldn't really make a difference ID-wise.

The Barbie hair has to be either Saran or Kanekalon hair. The site doesn't mention Barbie using other kinds. Tonner also uses Saran, but the site doesn't say if it uses only saran. The hair on my Antoinette Cameo... well, I can't really tell if it matches the 'matte' or 'shiny' Barbie hair as it's black and actually almost seems to fall somewhere in the middle. Maybe it's dusty and needs a wash. My best guess for now is that the 'shiny' is saran and the 'matte' is kanekalon, but... I thought kanekalon was pretty new, and the Midge doll is a twist-waist with a 1966 body sculpt and probably made sometime in the 80's-90's. Both kanekalon and saran are boil-resistant, so no 'testing' a sample to see if it frizzes to be sure which is which.

The Barbie hair can't be acetate, and it's very highly unlikely the Dollar Tree hair is, even though it's easily as shiny as the one doll shown on Dollyhair's acetate page rooted with the stuff.

I started to load the Gallery section, but shut it when I saw it was just going to be a whole massive page of pictures and no note of what was rooted with what hair... I'm on dialup, it would have taken forever to load and I still wouldn't have definitive answers.

[zirconmermaid]

Kanekalon has actually been around for a while. I had falls of it back in the 70s. The older Barbie hair is most likely Saran. Just because the body says 1966, that does not mean necessarily that the doll is from then. That's the copyright date. The dollar store hair is the cheapest hair available. Definitely not Kanekalon. Probably Nylon. Boil with care. It works, but be gently with it - 10 seconds is plenty of time, and don't try to change it later with more boiling.

[SillyLilPuppet]

Most all newer Barbie hair is kanekalon, the soft fluffy stuff. Its very popular because of the fine texture and how easily its set, though it does frizz quickly with play. I think Liv dolls use this too.

Really the only way you're going to know how the hair will react is to do a test strand of each bundle from each doll, test it in boiling water, and just lump the hair that reacts the same together. I'd do this even if the hair type was confirmed, really. That said, I've boil permed MH dolls, Barbie dolls, Obitsu dolls, My Little Ponies, offbrand dolls/toys, and varioius bjd wigs, and with very few exceptions as long as you're careful and don't let it touch the metal of the pot, it should be fine. Its only going to be in the water a short time, and you can almost always give it a second dip. I actually did a how to somewhere in Tutorials or Tips and Tricks I think using an Obitsu (they're nylon I think?)

[DollyKim]

Dollar Tree hair on headbands with a braid? No idea what kind it is but I've used them, all three girls I did went off to new happy homes. Definitely test what it will do. I haven't boiled any of it but when I was holding a head the warmth from my hand was enough to make it want to stay that way.

Here's a thread where I've used different DollyHair kinds. viewtopic.php?f=13&t=7745 The polypropylene has finer strands, the saran clumps in strands, the nylon is softer and smoother. Haven't used the kan yet. I've mixed nylon and saran without problems.

If you're really curious what each kind of DollyHair can do order a 38" hank of each kind. Cut each in 4 pieces for a Barbie and you'll have plenty of hair for a Barbie with the needle and thread method.

[WhiteDove01s]

Replies to zirconmermaid

Kanekalon has actually been around for a while. I had falls of it back in the 70s.

I didn't know that. Thanks.

Just because the body says 1966, that does not mean necessarily that the doll is from then. That's the copyright date.

Yeah, if I thought she was really that old, she wouldn't be in the Back Room Experiment pile. I basically meant that she's not a 'bellybutton' one, but one of the kinds they had around when I was a kid. I think she might even have been one of my cousin's.

The dollar store hair is the cheapest hair available. Definitely not Kanekalon. Probably Nylon. Boil with care. It works, but be gently with it - 10 seconds is plenty of time, and don't try to change it later with more boiling.

Thanks. I'm probably not going to boil perm in most cases, other than whatever steps are needed to get the hair to lay down after rooting, but I do like to know how things might react to what I might do to them.

Replies to SillyLilPuppet

Most all newer Barbie hair is kanekalon, the soft fluffy stuff. Its very popular because of the fine texture and how easily its set, though it does frizz quickly with play. I think Liv dolls use this too.

That sounds like most of the matte stuff. Came off Bellybutton Barbies with the exception of the Midge, and it's very fluffy and soft, almost like fur.

Really the only way you're going to know how the hair will react is to do a test strand of each bundle from each doll, test it in boiling water, and just lump the hair that reacts the same together. I'd do this even if the hair type was confirmed, really.

I'll set up a test date and some samples and confirm then. Thanks.

Replies to DollyKim:

Dollar Tree hair on headbands with a braid?

Yes, that's the stuff! I spent about $8 and got two of the brown, two of the yellow blond, two of the red, one of the white-blond, and one of the neat dark magenta. The Evil Overlord already wants her single large barbie rerooted with a mix of the brown, red, and magenta. XD I'll probably spend most of my free time today carefully combing out any tangles, braiding it up to prevent future ones, and snipping it off the headbands for storage. And being sure to remove the braid across the top too. So far, my favorite is the weird magenta, even if I can't think of any of my headcast with that color hair... well, except Digit's 'kool aid stripes'...

I haven't boiled any of it but when I was holding a head the warmth from my hand was enough to make it want to stay that way.

I'll test some of it with lower temps first and see what happens. I know I'll be glad if I don't have to deal with boiling water for any needed styling.

Here's a thread where I've used different DollyHair kinds. viewtopic.php?f=13&t=7745 The polypropylene has finer strands, the saran clumps in strands, the nylon is softer and smoother. Haven't used the kan yet. I've mixed nylon and saran without problems

Thanks a lot for that! It really helps to see how the kinds of hair really look on a doll. It also really looks from those that the nylon has much more of a shine, which also matches the Dollar Tree hair, and the rest are somewhat in the middle as far as shine. The shine/reflectiveness concerns me as much as the texture does, maybe a little more, because I have some charas for whom that would work and some that it wouldn't... and I wouldn't want to get hair that's the right color and have it still be off. What can I say, I can be picky. XD

If you're really curious what each kind of DollyHair can do order a 38" hank of each kind. Cut each in 4 pieces for a Barbie and you'll have plenty of hair for a Barbie with the needle and thread method.

I managed to get Fabri-Tac yesterday at a hobby store I rarely get to visit, so I can rework my eventual Dollyhair order... and there are colors I'm interested in in more than one kind. I'll stagger my order around a bit and get different kinds when I save for it, and use a little extra for testing purposes. Thanks for the idea.

[SillyLilPuppet]

Dollyhair does offer free samples of hair colors, you could probably ask for a sample of each hair type if you really wanna do an in person comparison. Its just a tiny little snippet of it, probably not enough to boil but probably enough to see the thickness/sheen/texture of each type. Instructions on the site say to just email her with the request.

[DollyKim]

The samples aren't enough to do anything but compare colors, and it is the way to go if you aren't sure which colors are exact.

The 38" hanks are totally worth it, I've been able to do a whole Monster head out of one (the green hair) and you'd get long enough hair on a Barbie to experiment with the styles.

[SetsunaKou]

We've gone through literally thousands of heads and hair/rooting and styling.
My sister and I make commissioned dolls and that's why we have a lot of experience with the types.

Dollyhair's boiling descriptions are inaccurate, to say the least. Maybe she's mixed them up but I know from all we've done and it's never failed:

1)Kanekalon - what 'real people' synthetic wigs and those long 60" extensions are made of. The extensions more matte, the longest type but some of the wig kanekalon is very shiny! (I.E. Lacey's costume wig of New York in particular) AND kanekalon is the best to take a curl or crimp. This BURNS/FRIZZES super easily and when we heat the water to perm the curls in---do NOT boil the water. Just take it to before boiling, when the little tiny bubbles are about to appear on the walls of the cup but not big or medium bubbling in the water. Still hot but almost bearable to touch. Either pour it over your doll's head or dip her in. (Making sure to 'test' some of the leftover hair before you dip your final rooted head in, to be sure it's not too hot.)

2)Saran - super soft, silky and light. This is my favorite type as it's shiny but soft AND will take a curl/crimp. It's more difficult to curl than kanekalon but it will eventually. The water for this needs to be a little hotter than for kanekalon and almost boiling, but not quite. It too will burn/frizz if the water is boiling, so be careful. It needs more heat and to be almost boiling so it's tricky. The only downside to saran is that it can 'tear' if you pull too hard on individual strands when rooting. However, it rarely happens and I still love it best. It's so pretty a look and feel!

3)Nylon - super shiny, sturdy, but a bit hard sometimes. Also this is nearly IMPOSSIBLE to curl/crimp permanently. We have to boil it at least 2-3 times before it even takes any perm! And after about 6 months, it will just fall out of shape anyway. The Dollyhair nylon is actually better/easier to curl and take a style, than the Dollar Tree nylon or Halloween costume wig nylon but all types are really tough to style in the end. The less costly real people's costume wigs (the type you see in stores around Halloween) are a very rough/tough grade of nylon. They're nice enough but if you use it for doll hair, you won't be able to style/curl it for long. The Dollyhair nylon, if you boil perm (full, rolling boil water poured over them!) it 2-3 times, it will stay in style for several months. This is also the hair that Volks and Obitsu use on their 1/6 heads.

If you want a curl, but shiny get saran. If you want ultra durable and shiny but not curled, get nylon. If you want a super crazy curly, set, or crimped style, use kanekalon.

Basically, the perming is this, starting at lowest heat, to highest:

1)Synthetic Wig Kanekalon - very very hot water, but not anywhere near boiling
2)Kanekalon - slighter hotter than above, but still not close to boiling
3)Saran - Almost boiling but not quite.
4)Doll grade Nylon - Full boil, at least 2-3 times (let doll dry, then pour/dip again, dry, then pour/dip again)
5)Costume Wig nylon - full rolling boil is necessary and even then, it may not perm. At least 3-5 times and dip the whole head in the water (not pour over). The head has to sit in the boiling water for at least a full minute each time.


Do not mix any type of Kanekalon with the other 2 as their boil perming temps are super different.


I know it sounds crazy to write differently than dollyhair's description, but honestly, we've rooted and boil permed at LEAST 1000 heads (conservative number there) of all types of hair and styles, and the results are what I've listed above. I have frizz headed dolls I can show you from 'too hot water on Kanekalon' and even on saran! The nylon we can NOT burn/frizz with a boil no matter how hot the water is and the in fact, the hotter, more boiling water the better on nylon! And 2-3 times at least for nylon!

The final thing it all boils down to (pun!) is if you want a curl, go for Kanakelon or saran. If you want sturdy but not curly, go with nylon. ^^